Leafs talk 2


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03 Jun 2024 22:42:17
Montour. 6.5. Theodore. 5.2
Reilly. 7.5. Benoit. 1.4
Zadorov. 3.5. McCabe. 2.0
Liligren. 1.4

Matthew’s. 13.3. Domi. 4.0. Knies. .9
Taveras. 11. McCann 1.4. Nylander 11.5
Lindholm. 5.0. Joshua.

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03 Jun 2024 21:50:46
Hypothetical starting lineup for 24/ 25 leafs
I haven’t included all the moves but the main one is Marner to Vegas for Theodore. Most of the other moves are free agent signings. The emphasis is improving the defense, especially ability to move puck and quarterback for the power play. This list of players is right at the cap.
Suggest moves to make this lineup better with the understanding that money in must go out.
Goal $2.8
Woll, Stolarz, Jones. .8. 1.0. 1.0

Defense $27.5
Montour. 6.5
Theodore. 5.2
Reilly. 7.5
Zadorov. 3.5
McCabe. 2.0
Benoit. 1.4
Liligren. 1.4

Forwards. $56.5
Knies Matthew’s. Domi. .9. 13.3. 4
McMahon. Taveras. Nylander. 1.4. 11.0. 11.5
Joshua. Lindholm Jarnkrok. 3.0. 5.0. 2.1
Cowan. Homburg. Dewar. .8. .8. 1.0
Milton. Reeves. .8 1.4.

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03 Jun 2024 23:40:09
IMO I don't think these projections are even close to reality
Stolarz at $1M doesn't seem right, I would think $2M/ $2.25M
Montour projects to $7.5M, maybe signs for less if stays with Florida
Zadorov wants $5M minimum
Lily probably get $2.5M minimum
Lindholm won't be less than $6.75M, possibly even close to $8M

Domi, Joshua & Jones seem pretty realistic.

03 Jun 2024 23:55:32
Zadorov is looking for 5.5-6M no chance you’re getting him for 3.5. I think after watching that playoffs, he is worth 5.5M and some term.

04 Jun 2024 00:06:12
@Tags 97. Let’s assume your estimates are more accurate then don’t sign Lindholm and then are within cap. Obviously creates a hole which you could try to fix from within organization or you make additional moves. If we agree your numbers are correct then we can use the original team less Lindholm and see how people can improve on it.

04 Jun 2024 00:59:53
@Tags I thought exactly the same. This seems like a fantasy for those numbers.

03 Jun 2024 18:14:03
Looking at these d cores that are gonna be playing for a cup this year makes me think is the leafs issues their blueline or is it their forwards or is it goaltending kinda interesting I say probably all of the above haha

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03 Jun 2024 20:25:32
I'm with you Goat lol. It's a little of everything.

EDM doesn't have the strongest D-coprs imo, but that's less of an issue with Mcdavid/ Drais.

03 Jun 2024 23:49:37
Goaltending and coaching. It was Keefe who went with and stuck with Sammy. It's his style of play they were playing. Keefe will ha e learned from this. Unfortunately Dubas and Shanny decided the Leafs could be his learning team.

01 Jun 2024 17:04:27
We can talk forwards all we want but until the Lesfs get at least a quality number 2 and 3 puck moving defense nothing else matters.
Montour and Tanev are free agents. Signing both would improve the defense significantly.
A defense lineup of Montoya, McCabe, Reilly, Tanev, Benoit Liligren and Timmins or Neimina would be lmiles better than what was there this year. Talk about bringing back Edmonton and Lyubushkin does nothing but repeat a slow footed defense with no puck moving defense.
There are other d out there that could work. Until you fix the defense don’t even worry about forwards.

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01 Jun 2024 18:08:56
You know, everyone keeps saying that. But, when you pay 4 forwards 11+ each, and you can't score, I tend to think it'd a bigger issue.

01 Jun 2024 21:08:27
Almost all top teams have top notch puck moving defensemen. You can have best forwards in the world and if your defense can’t move the puck to them then they won’t score. Give this forward group, with or without Marner a good defense and they will be a completely different team.

01 Jun 2024 22:44:59
@DG like who? Which teams? Because nobody is giving you a Fox, Hughes, Makar, Josi, etc.

01 Jun 2024 23:08:45
I get where you are coming from, but I don't think getting the puck to the forwards was our issue against Boston. It was more forwards driving the middle. Neither Benoit or McCabe are strong puck movers but they normally play it safe, make a smart play for the break out. Long stretch passes should only be used a few times a game. It should not be the only exit strategy.

02 Jun 2024 10:38:15
It was still an issue in the Boston series but less so than usually because Boston wasn’t very strong. How often do you see TML defense carrying the puck out of their own end with speed through the neutral zone. Maybe Reilly once or twice. Compare that with Mccvoy who was creating scoring chances all over the ice.
The fact is every team that has won the cup in the past ten years had one or two really good puck moving defense. (Except penguins when Letang was hurt)
You obviously need good forwards and the leafs should try to improve in this area only after making there defense better.

02 Jun 2024 10:52:53
@LeafsLife, my post names a couple of defense you could get. Your reply ignores the issue and tries to down play the solution by throwing out names that obviously are the best in the league and not available to the leafs. A very silly argument. If you can’t have one or two of the top five then the point of getting defenseman is wrong. How about Montour, Tanev,
Skjei, Ekman-Larsson, all free agents. Trade for others, Theodore possibly Josi if Marner is in play. Would any two of them not make the leafs stronger on D.
Everyone complains you can’t keep rolling it back then why not fix their biggest issue with players that would significantly enhance puck movement and a couple of these guys would also give the power play a true quarterback with a great shot. Something else the leafs haven’t had in years.

02 Jun 2024 17:53:24
@DG you named defenceman. You just didn't name top notch D.

02 Jun 2024 21:26:17
@LeafsLife, where did I say any of these guys were top notch defenseman. What I said is all top teams have top notch puck moving D. I listed a few that would be good number 2 or 3 defenders that would improve the leafs ability to move the puck.

Again I point out that your reply suggests if you can’t get a top 5 defenseman in the league then don’t bother getting any. Makes no sense to me. The players I named are all top 50 or so defenseman. That means they would logically fit into a number 2 or 3 on almost any team in the league. But probably shouldn’t go after them because they aren’t one of the top 5.

Let’s keep Edmunston and lybushkin and Giordana and Brodie istead.
I’m not Wed to the guys I listed but to discard the argument because they aren’t top 5 is ridiculous.

03 Jun 2024 00:14:06
Almost all top teams have a top notch puck moving defenceman.


Was that meant ad a passing comment that has nothing to do with the Leafs and what they should acquire?

I didn't say add no one. I don't honestly think the issue is the D though. No, they don't move the puck well, but even when the puck is in the O-zone for a minute straight, nothing happens. The forwards all just skate in circles. That's a much bigger issue.

03 Jun 2024 02:04:16
The leafs had 24 goals from their defense. 5th lowest in the league. Ahead of teams like Chicago and Anaheim. Still think they don’t need D.

03 Jun 2024 02:37:21
TML had the second most goals in the league with 298. Colorado had the most at 302. If you only count goals by forwards Toronto had the most goals in the league. Yet Colorado’s defense scored 42 more goals than Toronto’s. (66 to 24)
Leafs had the lowest number of goals by defenseman of all playoff teams.
Colorado defense scored almost 22% of their goals and the leafs defense 8%
When scoring gets tougher in the playoffs would it be nice to count on more than just your forwards to score.

03 Jun 2024 08:58:48
@DG is that why I'm watching the Avs in the finals?

When scoring gets tough, good teams drive the net.

03 Jun 2024 10:33:39
Again a silly argument. Only two teams make the finals. And those two teams, Edmonton and Florida had 16 and 14 percent of their goals scored by defense.
By the way, Colorado has the highest goals per game in the playoffs.

03 Jun 2024 15:49:35
Is it just me or was Tanev just average? I know he was playing hurt by the end and he will put his body in front of any puck but he gets beat to the outside a lot and overall not that great with the puck. Makes the simple play every time. I’m kinda hoping they go a different way than Tanev like a Roy, Zadorov and a Carrier/ Desharnais type to play with Benoit. Zadorov really stood out this playoffs for me. Looked good with the puck, chipped in offensively and was obviously very physical. I think he would be a great add to the top especially knowing his best hockey is in playoffs.

31 May 2024 12:17:54
I've been watching the London knights a lot of late and I got to say the leafs have something with Easton cowan.. The knights literally use this kid in every situation and he shows such a mature game has lots of speed good at both ends of the ice I think he can make the team out of camp next year his only knock is he needs to put on some weight with being a small guy. I have to admit I was against the puck last year but someone knew what they were talking about.

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31 May 2024 21:03:35
He is gonna be exciting. If they move Mitch out, there could be space for him in the top 9. Wouldn’t want to see him go back to junior again. I also love the Dakota Joshua talks of him being interested in signing in Toronto. Things could be looking up once the deal Mitchell.

01 Jun 2024 13:12:47
I like Cowan. He wasn't very noticeable at the World Juniors though. He was OK, but not a standout by any means.
If he can make the team, great. If not, send him back to Junior or he plays overseas I guess.

01 Jun 2024 15:56:33
@RLF I'm thinking the same. Media hypes everyone up as if they're the second coming. Cowan could be anything from a bust to a top 6 forward, we just don't know yet.

01 Jun 2024 21:15:34
Agreed boys about the World Juniors, but keep in mind Cowan was a year younger than most on the team.
If he's not on the Leafs, then definitely a shoe-in to be on Team Canada again. I would expect a lot more from him this time around.

01 Jun 2024 22:45:35
@Tags no doubt it doesn't mean everything. I just caution all Leafs fans to temper expectations.

02 Jun 2024 15:32:51
I'm not knocking Cowan. I'm just saying that it may be asking too much for him to be a 1st line player right away or even be impactful in the NHL at this point. He looks good. The NHL is a different game. World Juniors is best on best and he didn't really standout. Let's see how he looks at camp and go from there. If he can step in and be impactful, what a bonus for the Leafs that would be.

31 May 2024 01:31:29
In reference to a previous proposal of yours.
I found this very interesting.

Intriguing connection to Brendan Shanahan could land Luke Evangelista in Toronto!
Evangelista is Shanahan's cousin!

The Leafs have a lot of skill up front, so they don't necessarily need to peruse the market for more 30-goal scorers. They need punch, dynamism, and a "punk-like" essence which can all be found in Nashville Predators' forward, Luke Evangelista.

"I describe him as, like, a punk," Preds forward Tommy Novak said of the backward-hat-wearing, cool-lingo-slinging, 22-year-old Evangelista. "A young punk."

He's just an agitator, man. He's a good kid, I love him," McCarron said of Evangelista. "But that situation? I was pissed. But that's 'Vange.' Ask anybody in here and they've got a story about him. Everybody's got one."

Sounds like he would be a good acquisition for the Leafs.

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31 May 2024 13:39:24

I am not as high on him as his teammates. lol
He's not overly big or physical and he was given a lot of sheltered minutes last season. He is still young though. Talented player, but pretty loose with the puck and he needs to clean that up. I like he's from Toronto. I'm on the fence with this guy. I'm really not sure what he is going to turn into. If he had that physical element, I would be even more interested. I'm not sure he is sure about how he has to play to be the best NHLer he can. He's not a high end talent, so he has to develop the other parts of his game. imo

I have had him in props in the past coming to Toronto. I'm really not sure how much Nashville values him.

If Nash would do something like Liljegren and Robertson for Evangelista and Carrier's rights. I wouldn't mind something like that.

02 Jun 2024 01:18:05
@RLF ever heard a teammate bad mouth a teammate? Doesn't happen unless he's the worst of the worst. I tend not to listen to player statements for that reason.

02 Jun 2024 15:34:59
LL. Agreed. Same thinking is what sparked my opening comment. Now that doesn't mean I don't think he is any good, just he hasn't been as impactful as those statements by teammates. imo.

30 May 2024 01:03:33
Not sure who Leafs target as UFAs, all I care about is NMC and NTC. They can't keep handing them out like candy.
I mean David Kampf and Calle Jarnkrok both have 10 team NTC.
Especially when your signing Ufas that are 28-29 years old to longer term ( because they want it) , the contracts should be constructed so the last few years have no protection.

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30 May 2024 15:45:38
I agree with what you're saying, especially for non-star player's.
Maybe they should limit the NMC/ NTC to first half of term & second half should either be a M-NTC maxed out at 7 teams or no restrictions all together.

31 May 2024 21:07:39
I agree Jmaxx. that's the one thing that bothered me more than anything about Nylanders contract. A full NMC for 8 years is dumb. He could turn into a more expensive Huberdeau by next year and we pay that for 8 years?

27 May 2024 23:58:11
I predict the following players will be pursued by the Leafs July 1st

Matt Roy
Jake Debrusk
Chandler Stevenson
Phillip Myers
Josh Brown
Conor Brown
William Foegle
Shawn Monahan

Domi, Bertuzzi will not be re-signed as they want to much for what they provide

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28 May 2024 08:57:28
When did the cap go to 120m?

28 May 2024 20:47:55
Hard to tell what they are going after in free agency until we see who they get back from the Marner trade. But I like Roy, Debrusk and bring back Domi after Mitch is gone.

25 May 2024 16:59:42
The problem with the leafs is they can’t score in the playoffs. It is not that they can’t play defense. The scoring problem is a direct result of not having any defense that can move the puck (excluding Reilly) . Therefore to support the defense getting out of their own end the forwards have to drop deeper and very seldom are going through the neutral zone at full speed. To fix this Torontyneeds to improve the mobility on defense. If you are keeping Reilly, McCabe and Benoit then you need to add puck moving defenders like Montour or Theodore or someone else that moves the puck.

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25 May 2024 20:09:42
I think a lot of people confuse puck moving D with D that get points.

Muzzin and Brodie both supported the breakout well, and are gone.

I'd say any top defenceman can help with this, I wouldn't say it needs to be Montour-like.

I'd love to get Theodore.

26 May 2024 02:52:39
I agree with LL they leafs get zero offence from their blue line you look at the final four

Edmonton- Bouchard ekholm
Dallas: hieskenen Harley
Florida- Montour
Rangers- fox

You need a guy back there that can produce Reilly did that once and it was last year against Tampa.

27 May 2024 14:32:40
I don't necessarily disagree that the Leafs need a really good 2 way D-man, but the forwards do not come back deep and help the D move the puck. I rarely see that. Normally, at least 2 of the 3 and sometimes all 3 forwards blow the zone looking for long passes giving the d-men few options and this is why they have no speed through the neutral zone. They are standing still waiting for long passes or if a forward does get it at his own blueline the other two are already waiting at the opposition blueline which kills any chance of speed through the neutral zone.
I wish at least two forwards came back deeper to support the puck and then they can move through the neutral zone with some speed.

24 May 2024 18:01:46
Whats wong with all u guys, with low balling marner..hes the 2nd/3rd best rw in the league..u guys are nuts on here, if your going to make marner trade proposals, at least make them worthy of reading...but just to let ya know,theres only 3 teams he said hell except a trade too and i just dont see it happening, and if an extension doesnt happen, he'll play out his contractand have the best season of any leaf, and then say
f....u...but with berube their, and the way he coaches, you think hes going to want to let marner go..i doubt it...hes one of the best two way players in the game.i can see berube rather trading nylander...but im gonna say it first, the core stays intact for at least one more season..

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24 May 2024 20:40:31
Stop drinking the kool-aid.

Wingers above Mitch include, but are not limited to:


It's a pretty long list.

24 May 2024 23:16:24
@DM I wasn't summoning you. I meant Jason Robertson.

25 May 2024 12:24:37
S. cor
There are many who have opined that the Core4 would stay so I don’t think you’re the first!

If my math is correct there are at least 256 wingers in the NHL. You have listed 6 (and catch all language not limited to) .

I think it’s safe to state that Marner is in the top 5%.

As to trading Marner, I don’t think it’s low-balling his value as much as it’s recognizing the Leaf’s lack of leverage and the desire to free up cap space to seek other replacement needs.

I’d rather it be a Tavares move but he also won’t waive and any trade would require retention which minimizes freeing up cap.

25 May 2024 16:07:12
@Rsears I don't dispute Mitch is top 5% though. He is a good player. It's the statement that he's a top 3 winger in the NHL I take issue with.

25 May 2024 19:22:32
I should have read it more closely. You’re right.
He’s definitely not 2 or 3; needs to be much more impactful in playoff hockey!

26 May 2024 02:54:48
Marner might be a top 5 right winger but he makes
Difference maker money and we haven’t seen that in his time with the leafs especially come playoff time when things get physical.

26 May 2024 05:00:02
@Goat I'm not sure he is top 5. That's my point. Top 5 players make a difference regardless of position.

24 May 2024 15:20:46
So who among us think Keefe will flourish in NJ?

It will be interesting to watch.

I think he will get them back in the playoffs and they will be a R1 winner.

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24 May 2024 17:32:54
I think it will be interesting for sure I think jersey has a similar roster to the leafs.

24 May 2024 18:18:04
I think Keefe is shown to be a dud in Jersey. I don't think his systems work that well, I think Jersey starts hot next year and and falls off in the second half of the season.

24 May 2024 20:09:38
Don't think it matter if Scottie Bowman coaches them. All winning coaches have more than a scarecrow in net. Jersey might as well just play 6 on 5 for 60 minutes every game.


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